OpenID

OpenID Foundation/Board/Minutes/2007-02-01

These are the approved minutes from the meeting of the 1st Feburary 2007.

Present:

  • Bill Washburn (moderating)
  • David Recordon
  • Drummond Reed
  • Dick Hardt
  • Johannes Ernst (note taker)
  • Martin Atkins
  • Scott Kveton

Apologies

  • Arthur Bergman (excused due to travel)

Announcement

General agreement on the latest draft distributed to the mailing list without the "cool, cool". Minor wording clarification. Johannes moves (Drummond seconds) to send out the announcement to the mailing lists. No abstentions, no nays. Motion passes unanimously among those in attendance.

David will hold announcement until Arthur has a chance to confirm that he wants his name on it as a signatory (expectation: within 12-24 hours). Regardless of whether Arthur's name will be signed, the announcement will go out.

IPR

Johannes: We need to sort out IPR clearly and cleanly. As a first step, we should all put the OSP in place.

Drummond: agrees, one of the main charters of the foundation. Small concern: OSP has no injunctive relief provision, is not a license, thus it works much better for large companies not for small companies.

Dick: this is a complex subject, we need a full plan, not just an ad-hoc first step.

David: OSP is largely the conclusion that he and Gabe came to, as a first step.

Johannes: OpenID protocols need to at least get on par with Microsoft CardSpace protocols, and quickly.

Motion (1) by Dick: Gabe and David should put together a written strategy how to solve all the IPR issues, and the board should discuss and vote on it.

Martin: seconding motion (1). Amendment by Martin: We should also discuss doing OSP now. (2)

Johannes seconds Martin's amended motion (2). Also, feels it is important that board members make a public statement on behalf of the board and the entities they represent (companies, individuals) and lead by example for what OpenID is all about, so OSP statement should be made now.

Discussion of (2).

Drummond: what is the role of IPR in the OpenID community? "Park your IPR at the door"? Meritocracy?

Dick withdraws motion (1).

Scott: IPR needs to solved right here and now on this call.

Scott: Dick: you are using your IPR offensively to get a seat at the table, not defensively, not okay.

Johannes: we also have IPR, but we decided to "leave the IPR at the door" with respect to our contributions into OpenID. There is IPR we own that we don't want to give away, but we do this by not contributing it to OpenID.

Drummond: respects IPR, is more a philosophical / value issue for what OpenID is all about.

Bill: Drummond, what is the opposite of "meritocracy"?

Drummond: anything that interferes with the natural course of the process by which the community creates consensus. If you are part of the community, you should not use IPR to sway the community.

Scott: Dick's use of IPR is completely against the way the OpenID community operates.

Dick: IPR always plays a role in any standard. When Sxip joined the community, existing OpenID specifications (declared as "nobody should own this") had already be in conflict with the Sxip IPR.

Dick: wants a place at the table, feels that unless Sxip speaks up, they will not have a seat at the table.

Johannes: opposed to having special rights for anybody in the bylaws.

Scott: knows of other large sites that have asked for special rights; he has answered that it "would not work with the community"

Bill: is this a black-and-white issue, or is it shades of grey?

Johannes: OpenID specifications developed under OpenID foundation umbrella need to be open and free, there are no shades of grey on that issue (perhaps there are on other issues). Drummond: agrees. David: agrees, there should be not patents within the OpenID community, because OpenID benefits everybody.

Dick: in a usual standards process, that wouldn't have been a problem.

Johannes: did not mean to say that no IPR possible in connection with OpenID, just not by contributors to OpenID. Example: electric grill: if somebody in the OpenID community defined how to connect an electric grill to OpenID, and that violated somebody else's patents, simply by virtue of being in the community that cannot mean that the electric grill owner is forced to surrender IPR. Must be connected to actual contribution.

Dick: don't leave IPR at the door, but bring it in

Scott: but under the condition that specs take a certain direction If Jan Rain didn't contribute, we should get kicked out; same thing should apply to everybody.

Drummond: this is how the game is played in other forums, but not in this forum

Dick: initial board roster was not done on meritocracy.

Johannes: only backwards-looking, how are we going forward, now Sxip has a seat at a table?

Dick: concerned about future role

Johannes: Need to pull forward definition of rules on elections, board elegibility, ... as soon as possible.

Martin: two issues: IPR, and board composition (mostly the latter).

Drummond: do we do a quick resolution, or need more discussion?

Bill: even if process had flaws by which this group was formed, even if it violated some principles that we want to adopt, it does not mean we can't find a good way forward that is consistent with its principles.

(Dick had to leave).

Bill: not comfortable with substantive discussion going forward given that Dick not present. General agreement.

Call ended with agreement to continue on Monday 5th Feb.

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